Poll: Should we keep the PT cap?

Boomcheck · 02-27-2019, 01:30 AM

02-27-2019, 01:17 AMEggy216 Wrote:
02-27-2019, 01:15 AMBoomcheck Wrote: Can't let people go wild with TPE, if you're saying that. the 40 cap is fine and I don't quite understand the issue.

Unless this is about indicating caps in the update thread

But what if the amount of "capped" TPE available is already around 40? It's not about increasing the amount of TPE available, it's more about making the experience of earning TPE simpler. It wouldn't allow people to go wild with TPE.

I'm pretty sure it can stretch around 10 or so extra TPE. Depend on how the weeks go etc etc.

The system as put in place to stop the hoarders. Regression is down right awful and doesn't really hinder players as is. You want to keep giving them more ammo to fend it off?

This can hurt the lower ring guys that may not be able to do all the PTs which was part of the reason we had a cap anyways.

Personally speaking, I couldn't relate to like 2 PTs and just didn't do them. I still managed to hit the 4 cap, albeit the very last pay out for it.

The issue seems to be people's path. Maybe just indicate cap in player's pages, so updaters can update that and keep track there instead of having to go through everything each time they have to update. Keep track through out the season and they should be gravy. Why even have an updater job if they can't do the work? Is there a shortage? Does no one want to do the job?

Other sim leagues have self serve update systems that work pretty well, maybe I can get you folk in contact with the sbao staff.

Avakael · 02-27-2019, 01:30 AM

02-27-2019, 01:28 AMDangles13 Wrote: The reason for removing the cap would be because it can be confusing and doesn't really do its job. It also hampers people who want or have tried to code things for updating in the past.

I hope you've seen the updating portal system the VHL has very recently introduced (and that the SBA apparently also has). That's what we need to aim for.

notorioustig · 02-27-2019, 01:36 AM

Hard agree with removing the cap. If a few people get 46 TPE instead of 40, so be it. It avoids a lot of confusion and if a small handful of people end up scoring an extra 6-7 TPE in a season, I really don't think that's outrageous or gamebreaking

JKortesi81 · 02-27-2019, 01:55 AM

I've always thought the cap was weird, but slightly understood it when we were giving out more PbP and PGS TPE to everyone. It helped "dial it back" a little bit. But nowadays you're talking about such a small difference that the benefits can outweigh a few people getting that "extra 2" TPE. When it was implemented, we had more tpe opportunities. Now that those have been scaled back and our seasons tend to move quicker, no reason to keep a cap.

PBE and NSFL don't have the capped TPE, and it's working out just fine over there. I'd say remove it.

DeletedAtUserRequest · 02-27-2019, 01:57 AM

From a point task perspective we run the same things every season.... if you had a good season you’ll sit between 38-43 capped...if you have had an amazing tpe season you can come close to 48-50 ...we can manipulate the tpe amount up or down or add and subtract tasks so we don’t necessarily need the PT cap if it makes things easier.

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Eggy216 · 02-27-2019, 01:58 AM

02-27-2019, 01:57 AMMike Izzy Wrote: From a point task perspective we run the same things every season.... if you had a good season you’ll sit between 38-43 capped...if you have had an amazing tpe season you can come close to 48-50 ...we can manipulate the tpe amount up or down or add and subtract tasks so we don’t necessarily need the PT cap if it makes things easier.

To clarify, your numbers refer to milestones getting you to 48-50, right?

DeletedAtUserRequest · 02-27-2019, 02:01 AM

02-27-2019, 01:58 AMEggy216 Wrote:
02-27-2019, 01:57 AMMike Izzy Wrote: From a point task perspective we run the same things every season.... if you had a good season you’ll sit between 38-43 capped...if you have had an amazing tpe season you can come close to 48-50 ...we can manipulate the tpe amount up or down or add and subtract tasks so we don’t necessarily need the PT cap if it makes things easier.

To clarify, your numbers refer to milestones getting you to 48-50, right?

Correct.

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Eggy216 · 02-27-2019, 02:05 AM

02-27-2019, 02:01 AMMike Izzy Wrote:
02-27-2019, 01:58 AMEggy216 Wrote: To clarify, your numbers refer to milestones getting you to 48-50, right?

Correct.

Thank god, I didn't think I was that bad at counting lol.

Dangles13 · 02-27-2019, 02:05 AM

02-27-2019, 01:30 AMAvakael Wrote:
02-27-2019, 01:28 AMDangles13 Wrote: The reason for removing the cap would be because it can be confusing and doesn't really do its job. It also hampers people who want or have tried to code things for updating in the past.
I hope you've seen the updating portal system the VHL has very recently introduced (and that the SBA apparently also has). That's what we need to aim for.

VHL is much more polished than SBA but I would agree, having something like that here would be amazing. I have no idea how to go about doing it though.

ml002 · 02-27-2019, 02:23 AM

Considering there isn't that much more to earn from pure effort and the rest is Simon's will, there is really no need for the cap

Credit to Copenhagen, Wasty, FlappyGiraffe, InciteHysteria, and caltroit_red_flames
[Image: MM4nqx6.png]

xDParK · 02-27-2019, 02:32 AM

02-27-2019, 01:09 AMligma Wrote: keep it if you're planning to add more TPE opportunities

remove if you're going to keep things relatively the same imo

Agreed

GoonerBear · 02-27-2019, 02:48 AM

So I calculated out how this might affect two highly active players with similar habits, accuracy on tasks that award bonus points and milestone points. I made the following assumptions:

Player A and Player B both create and are approved the same day, at the very start of Offseason 0. Both players submit their first regression during Offseason 11.
Under the current capped system, Player A and Player B both earn roughly 170 TPE on average every season. They both consistently cap every season after they are drafted to the SHL (i.e. they haven't had their first chance to diverge until they hit the big boy league)
Player A earns 10 more TPE per season than Player B. Player B still earns as many as they would have under the capped system. This accounts for an extreme case where Player A gets Izzy's "amazing TPE season" every season while B still, effectively, caps and does nothing more.
Both players retire during Offseason 21 after the Commissioner says "you may now retire and keep your player."

Here is an illustration of the results, laid out on a table (including season-by-season differences) and plotted.

[Image: afd9f97ea0.png]

ml002 · 02-27-2019, 03:09 AM

02-27-2019, 02:48 AMGoonerBear Wrote: So I calculated out how this might affect two highly active players with similar habits, accuracy on tasks that award bonus points and milestone points. I made the following assumptions:

Player A and Player B both create and are approved the same day, at the very start of Offseason 0. Both players submit their first regression during Offseason 11.

Under the current capped system, Player A and Player B both earn roughly 170 TPE on average every season. They both consistently cap every season after they are drafted to the SHL (i.e. they haven't had their first chance to diverge until they hit the big boy league)

Player A earns 10 more TPE per season than Player B. Player B still earns as many as they would have under the capped system. This accounts for an extreme case where Player A gets Izzy's "amazing TPE season" every season while B still, effectively, caps and does nothing more.

Both players retire during Offseason 21 after the Commissioner says "you may now retire and keep your player."

Here is an illustration of the results, laid out on a table (including season-by-season differences) and plotted.

r/graphporn

Credit to Copenhagen, Wasty, FlappyGiraffe, InciteHysteria, and caltroit_red_flames
[Image: MM4nqx6.png]

Avakael · 02-27-2019, 03:51 AM

02-27-2019, 02:05 AMDangles13 Wrote:
02-27-2019, 01:30 AMAvakael Wrote: I hope you've seen the updating portal system the VHL has very recently introduced (and that the SBA apparently also has). That's what we need to aim for.

VHL is much more polished than SBA but I would agree, having something like that here would be amazing. I have no idea how to go about doing it though.

It's an SQL database with a set of PHP pages for display, input, and output of data. There's several people in the community with the knowhow to make it happen, although perhaps not the time. There are two questions- how does the simmer update the sim files from the database; and how does the database learn how much TPE each player has available to spend? I don't know how the VHL does the former, and there appears to be a reviewed honour system for entry of the latter.

Katth · 02-27-2019, 04:29 AM

02-27-2019, 02:48 AMGoonerBear Wrote: So I calculated out how this might affect two highly active players with similar habits, accuracy on tasks that award bonus points and milestone points. I made the following assumptions:

Player A and Player B both create and are approved the same day, at the very start of Offseason 0. Both players submit their first regression during Offseason 11.

Under the current capped system, Player A and Player B both earn roughly 170 TPE on average every season. They both consistently cap every season after they are drafted to the SHL (i.e. they haven't had their first chance to diverge until they hit the big boy league)

Player A earns 10 more TPE per season than Player B. Player B still earns as many as they would have under the capped system. This accounts for an extreme case where Player A gets Izzy's "amazing TPE season" every season while B still, effectively, caps and does nothing more.

Both players retire during Offseason 21 after the Commissioner says "you may now retire and keep your player."

Here is an illustration of the results, laid out on a table (including season-by-season differences) and plotted.

That's a pretty amazing graph to put things into perspective.

This is only my second season on the site, but I find capped TPE just a hassle and I can see why it's pretty difficult for updaters to keep track of. I'd remove it solely for the fact to make things easier. That some people will then have the opportunity to earn more TPE than others than so be it. Activity should be rewarded.

S50 Challenge Cup Finals Game 7
[Image: gNFVjT6.png]

Poll: Should we keep the PT cap? You do not have permission to vote in this poll.
Keep it	29.06%	34	29.06%
Get rid of it	60.68%	71	60.68%
Don't care	10.26%	12	10.26%
Total		117 vote(s)	100%

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